Radio interview ABC AM with Sabra Lane

Sabra Lane, Host: Australia's abstained from a United Nations vote in which a majority of countries demanded Israel withdraw from the West Bank and Gaza within a year. More than two‑thirds of the Chamber voted for it, 14 voted against and Australia was among 43 countries to abstain.

The vote is symbolic, it can't be enforced. And joining us now to explain Australia's reasons is the Foreign Minister, Penny Wong, live from our Parliament House studio. Good morning and welcome.

Penny Wong, Foreign Minister: Good morning, good to be with you, Sabra.

Lane: We'll get to the vote in a moment. First, this latest wave of exploding devices, what's your reaction to that?

Foreign Minister: Well, first, obviously Hizballah is a terrorist organisation supported by Iran, and is listed as such in Australia, but this does reflect the concern I have raised for some time about the possibility of a wider escalation, a regional conflict, and which is why I have been calling for months now for any Australians in Lebanon to return to Australia whilst they still can. The consequences of regional escalation are obviously substantial.

Lane: Our correspondent tells us that there is fear and panic in the civilian population in Lebanon with many civilians injured and killed in these attacks. Some human rights groups say that this is state terrorism. Is it?

Foreign Minister: Look, yeah, we do recognise, as I said, Hizballah as a terrorist organisation, and we recognise the unique security circumstances of the State of Israel. Having said that, you know, we are concerned at all the violence. There is a cycle of violence in the Middle East. We continue to see civilians in Gaza lost, we obviously have seen civilians attacked in Israel, and our focus is to do what we can from a very long way away to continue to advocate a pathway to peace. That is the only way in which we will see security for both Israelis and Palestinians and self‑determination for the Palestinian people.

Lane: Israel is talking about a new phase of the war. How does this bring about peace in Gaza?

Foreign Minister: As I said, you know, we would say to all parties, as I have for some time, that the risks and consequences of a wider war in the Middle East for the security of all peoples, including the people of Israel, are potentially dire.

So we have continued like, as others have, including the United States, to urge restraint on all parties.

Lane: To the United Nations vote, Australia abstained. Did we do that to appease Israel, or to keep on side with the United States which voted no?

Foreign Minister: Neither. We did that because we looked very carefully at the resolution. Frankly, we were in a position where we were wanting to be able to vote for a resolution which did reflect closely the ICJ opinion, which gave impetus to a pathway to peace, and we worked very hard in New York with others, including the Palestinian delegation, to seek amendments that would enable us to support it, as we did the recognition vote, and the ceasefire vote, where text enabled Australia to support it, and we were disappointed that the amendments that we and many others sought were not accepted. For that reason we abstained.

I would say there are many things that the resolution calls for we are already doing. We do not supply weapons to Israel. We have imposed sanctions on a range of extremist settlers, Israeli settlers, and we will deny any extremist settlers a visa to Australia. So there are things in the resolution we have already done.

We wish we were in a position to have been able to support it. But like the United Kingdom and Canada and Germany, we were not able to support it, and so we have therefore abstained.

Lane: Israel is furious about the vote, saying it simply rewards Hamas for the October 7 attacks and terrorism. Does it do that?

Foreign Minister: Look, our position is that, first, the October 7 attacks were an atrocity. What we also have said is that we want to see a ceasefire. 10,000 Palestinian children have been killed in this conflict.

Lane: But by abstaining are we also tacitly condoning settler violence and a lack of willingness on Israel's behalf to compromise?

Foreign Minister: No, I don't agree with that. And you see that in both what we say and what we do. I mean the fact that we have sanctioned settlers, and we have made clear we would deny extremist settlers a visa is a demonstration of our consistency around this, and you know, if there had been some, I think changes to the resolution, you would have seen even more countries' support, and you saw a number of countries who were prepared to vote in the recognition vote and the ceasefire vote who didn't support this resolution. You know, so be it. Countries have to make their, you know, the Palestinian delegation has to make its decisions. We would have liked to have been in a position to vote for a resolution that more directly reflected the ICJ advisory opinion, and we support many of the principles in the resolution, and we are acting on a number of the matters which are referenced.

Lane: You're in our Canberra studio today. The Senate is only sitting this week. You're the government leader in the Chamber. No government bills have actually been passed this week. What's wrong with the government's negotiating style that it can't get anything through?

Foreign Minister: Well, I don't think it's the government's negotiating style, I think ‑ and we've actually passed many bills through this Parliament. The problem is that Adam Bandt and Peter Dutton are a unity ticket, and when you've got the extremes of Australians ‑‑

Lane: But that is also the Parliament that Australians voted for.

Foreign Minister: Sure. But they make choices, Sabra. And Adam Bandt has chosen to block building more houses and enabled Peter Dutton to block building more houses. So I think we see – the Australian people can see that we have this unholy alliance of, you know, Mr Bandt and Mr Dutton walking arm in arm to block more houses being built. That's what's happened in the Senate this week.

Lane: Foreign Minister, Penny Wong, thanks for joining us this morning.

Foreign Minister: Good to speak with you.