Interview - Jason Morrison, 2GB

Subject: Seasonal Worker Scheme, Pakistan

MORRISON: I thought I'd turn to the Government to just make sure, I guess, that the country's interests are being looked out for here, and this is not the short term fix. Good of him to join us, and he has a number of times, Stephen Smith the Foreign Minister, is on the line. Minister, good morning to you.

STEPHEN SMITH: Good morning, how are you?

MORRISON: G'day. Well, thanks for joining us again. We're grateful to speak to you on this issue, because there's a few other things burning around too, but I'll deal with this first up, this guest worker thing. What checks and balances are in place to make sure, on a number of points, that these people are healthy when they get here, that there is no disease coming, and I know that'll sound obscene to suggest this, but these are troubled nations that they're coming from, some of them, and that they come here, that they are totally clean, and free of disease, and that they will go home?

SMITH: Well, we came to office with a promise that we would examine the New Zealand part of the program, which has been operating in New Zealand for a number of years, doing the same thing, bringing workers from Pacific Islands to New Zealand in various industries, for short periods, to meet demands of labour shortages.

So what we've announced in the last couple of days, through Tony Burke, our Agriculture Minister, is that we'll do a pilot program as well, up to 2500 workers from four Pacific Island countries, Tonga, Vanuatu, Kiribati and Papua New Guinea. Its demand driven, in other words the requirements that we will put in place will ensure that if there is an Australian, or someone based in Australia who is ready, willing and able to work in the horticulture industry, then they'll get the jobs first.

But the representations that we've received from the horticulture industry is that for a number of years, they've had severe shortages on a seasonal basis, and they can't find people in Australia to do the work, and as a consequence they have fruit rotting on the vine, or on the trees.

In terms of the regime, all of our usual visa and immigration requirements will apply, there'll be very strict screening so far as applicants are concerned, and when employees do arrive in Australia, they'll be subject to all of the usual visa requirements, and the employers who employ them, will be subject to very strict requirements, to ensure that they are paid the same conditions and entitlements that Australians are, so there's no undercutting.

MORRISON: But you'd know that we can't even get people to come here for World Youth Day, or the Olympic Games, on nice, friendly visas, and expect them to leave at the end, people stick around. How do we make sure that these people don't do this?

SMITH: Well, the visa will be up to a maximum of seven months over a 12 month period, but because the shortages are both seasonal and annual, what we've found in New Zealand is that there's a very good compliance rate, because people understand, they come, they get a good opportunity, and if they don't waste that opportunity, they can come back in future years.

And so one of the incentives for good behaviour, for working well, is that you know that if you satisfy all the conditions of your employment, and all the conditions of your visa, you get the chance to come back in the following year. That's the New Zealand experience.

But one of the reasons that we are only doing a pilot program is that yes, of course there are a range of policy issues here that we need to think through carefully, which is why we've said, in the first instance let's do a pilot program. We're going to review that pilot program halfway through, 18 months of a three year period, to see whether it's a success, to whether the requirements we've put in place are working effectively, and if it is successful, to see whether it might be sensible to expand the capacity to other areas of Australia, or indeed to other countries in the Pacific.

MORRISON: Has Warren Mundine got a point, when he says 83,000 Aboriginal people are in the job network on the dole system, without a job, need a job, and here we are bringing 2500 people in from around nations to service this? I mean, are we going for the quick fix here, and not saying this is something that we can fix here now? I mean 83,000 Aboriginal people are just the start of it, then there's the rest who are on unemployment benefits.

SMITH: Well, there are two reasons why we've done this. First are the very strong representations we've received from the agricultural or the horticultural industry...

MORRISON: But you know, I mean they have interests here, they want a quick fix, they want it fixed now.

SMITH: Well, but this is not something that has just occurred overnight...

MORRISON: Of course.

SMITH: ...two or three years ago, there was a Senate Inquiry where Senators from the major political parties, both agreed that this was something that the then Government should explore. Recently we had my predecessor, Alexander Downer, saying that he had raised the issue with the previous Government on a number of occasions, but without success, and his view this year, from Opposition, was that Australia should adopt such a scheme.

There are two reasons why we've done it. One, representations over a number of years, not weeks or months, but a number of years, that the horticultural industry, the agricultural industry, on a seasonal basis and particular reasons, simply can't find workers. But secondly, it is also a good thing to do in the Pacific, this is an opportunity for...

MORRISON: All right, I think we accept that, sorry to interrupt you, but I think we accept that, but 83,000 people, Aboriginal people, on the job network system, most of them in country areas...

SMITH: Well, I make the same comment about that, as I do...

MORRISON: But have we done anything to encourage them to fill these jobs?

SMITH: I make the same comment about that as I do generally. We've known for a number of years that there are job opportunities in regional Australia, on a seasonal basis in the horticultural industry. Anyone who's out there, who wants to get a job opportunity, knows that there is a job...

MORRISON: No, no, I accept that, I accept that.

SMITH: ...for them in regional Australia, and the problem is not something that's been driven by the Government, this has been driven by repeated representations by one of our important industries, that they simply can't find the workers, and as a consequence, fruit literally rots on the tree.

MORRISON: Yes, I mean there has to be a fix, and this is certainly one that gives us an immediate - I'd just like - I think a lot of people hope that we don't enter ourselves into a further opening of the doors.

If I can just move on to the issue of Mr Musharraf in Pakistan, I know the Australian Government would have a view on that, and I'd be interested to hear what you think, where we're at with this now?

SMITH: Well, President Musharraf has indicated he's proposing to resign, rather than face impeachment. What I've said in the past is that how Pakistan resolved that issue was a matter for the Pakistan political process. We're very pleased that Pakistan has moved back to a state of democracy in the face of Mrs Bhutto's assassination earlier this year, they stuck to their course and had the election.

What we now need to see from Pakistan is political stability, and that's very important, because in the Pakistan, Afghanistan area, is where in our view the current hot bed of international terrorism is. We've got over 1000 troops in Afghanistan, in Oruzgan Province, in areas abutting the Pakistan, Afghanistan border regions, so it has very important consequences for the safety of our troops there.

MORRISON: My word, it does.

SMITH: And what we're now looking for is a period of stability, where Pakistan, with the support of the regional international community, including Australia, can now get on the job of managing the affairs of Pakistan, including the very serious security and terrorist issues that it faces.

MORRISON: Well I say fingers crossed for the world, because it is profoundly important that that is a stable area, even though I think a lot of people accept that there's a buck each way, when it comes to Pakistan and their leadership, we never quite know really where they are, but I appreciate your time, Minister, thank you again.

SMITH: Thanks very much. Thank you.

MORRISON: Stephen Smith, the Foreign Minister.

SMITH: Good morning, how are you?